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Postby smootharnie » Sun Oct 16, 2016 12:03 pm

When I first saw this guy do his dryland swim movments I thought it looked ridiculous.
No one swims freestyle this way.
Now I still find the movments exagerated, but they do show the principal of the strange movements a lot of fast guys make.
It doesnt look so weird anymore, but if I trie his dryland routine in front of the mirror, my shoulders cry out loud and it looks pathetic, although better than before.
Can anyone be comfortable copying this guy?
(i know it is not needed to do so to swim pretty well, just curious how others compare)

Not a comfortable position. Or is it for you?

the clip
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Re: Ridiculous?

Postby Sprinter » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:11 pm

I have seen such extreme high-elbow exercises at other places.
I don't bother about that. I believe it will disappear partially, like the S-curve.
In any case, it seems rather clear to me that such swimming practice doesn't apply to older swimmers (for health reasons alone).

In this video one sees the combination of the high elbow with the narrow arm entry, which perhaps is especially difficult.
The extreme high-elbow swimmer Pipes-Neilson advocates a very wide hand entry, which might come from the fact, that this might be easier/more natural with a very high elbow.

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Re: Ridiculous?

Postby The Dodo » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:14 pm

What a strained attitude! The shot looks as if the bloke's right arm is already into the pull, because at the EVF catch the bent elbow should be a little way in front of the head and more out to the side - otherwise only a contorsionist or alien could drop the forearm/hand down vertically. The upper arm should IMO be at a 13:30 or 14:00 attitude relative to the head as the forearm/hand start to drop, leaving the upper arm up by the surface. As for the mid-recovery attitude of his left arm - well that's no way to prepare to spear into the water! If anything, the shot probably looks a bit like my arm disposition when my UW arm is already into the pull and the recovering arm is approaching water entry - i.e. a bit of "wind-milling" at that stage, due to starting arm recovery earlier than most others!

IMO at a catch, the backward-facing parts of the arm need to be as far ahead as possible, consistent with getting those backward-facing parts down deep enough to be effective (i.e pulling a bent arm without a sufficiently deep enough insertion is not going to provide much propulsion). The insertion of forearm/hand as a unit during the pull is effective, as is the slightly later SS style catch, which has a deeper insertion because some of the upper arm is backward-facing and helps provide greater surface for the subsequent pull.

If the catch is not far enough ahead, then obviously the range of the pull phase is shortened - which is a shame in FS, because after a good catch, a lot of propulsion can be gained from a strong pull.

It's different for fly! "SolarEnergy" said the effective shortening of the pull in fly stroke was mandatory. Letting the hands trail the elbows at the transition from out-sweep to up-sweep as the orientation of forearms/hands change from out/around to ready to press back/up - a bit like a dropped elbow in appearance at that transition - so as to provide a greater range for the forearms/hands to push back/up for the following more propulsive up-sweep. That action helps get the head up for an inhalation as the body is "levered" upwards by the effect of the fly major kick downbeat.

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Re: Ridiculous?

Postby SharkFM » Sun Oct 23, 2016 1:33 am

I don't think it's ridiculous.

Here's what happens:

1. During arm recovery or turnover, you must actually protect the body line alignment = underwater running surface
2. If you have reduced flexibility, YOU GO SLOW because the running surface gets distorted, upset by torsion in the spine, ETC

The extreme example of this is when dudes snake their way down the lane, you have all seen it.

So by over-doing it, you are increasing your ability to "protect the line"

I know this because - I am back to pool workouts and my speed is more constant than ever throughout the stroke action, esp as my arm comes over the top. Am I faster this season??


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